"Warmth" and Note Size

Music notation symbols, fonts, font sources and font creation, SmuFL.
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odod
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by odod »

Here's some notehead comparison .. some had gaps some don't but the angle also different on each noteheads.
Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.29.37.png
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Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.29.22.png
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Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.29.11.png (11.46 KiB) Viewed 7377 times
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Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.28.21.png (11.45 KiB) Viewed 7377 times
Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.27.59.png
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Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.27.40.png
Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.27.40.png (11.34 KiB) Viewed 7377 times
Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.27.29.png
Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.27.29.png (14.38 KiB) Viewed 7377 times
Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.27.18.png
Screen Shot 2019-10-14 at 13.27.18.png (12.27 KiB) Viewed 7377 times
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John Ruggero
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by John Ruggero »

OCTO, here are the first two systems (without all of the editorial additions) using Maestro. it is only roughly proofread, so there might be errors. I also supply a Finale 25.5 default file of the same below:
op 106.3 Maestro.jpeg
op 106.3 Maestro.jpeg (213.1 KiB) Viewed 7351 times
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John Ruggero
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by John Ruggero »

Odod, that is a very interesting comparison. Would you want to identify the fonts? Or are they all your own design?

The Associated Board black note head is very full without going over the staff lines:
Associated Board Black Notehead.jpeg
Associated Board Black Notehead.jpeg (61.78 KiB) Viewed 7334 times
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odod
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by odod »

My own designed fonts .. but all not done yet :(
this one done in Finale using yours, but different settings
and i think it was full because it came from a scanned or printed music .. we need to find the digital version for a comparison
op 106.3 Default.png
op 106.3 Default.png (1.42 MiB) Viewed 7318 times
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OCTO
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by OCTO »

John Ruggero wrote: 14 Oct 2019, 21:55 The Associated Board black note head is very full without going over the staff lines:
That is very important.
Note preferences in my opinion are following:
1. Note width
2. Contact surface
3. White balance for :5 :6 :7

As I proposed earlier, it is not the size of the notehead that is important. The larger noteheads will not result in easier reading.
It is the combination of 1+2 above: the note has to have enough large "contact surface" in order to increase the compactness and thus increase a "visual stability". If the contact surface is too small, the notes seem to drop out from the page, regardless how wide they are.

With the white balance, it is important to think about the note "on the staff line", so that the strength of the contours are not to weak in comparison to the line, and that the line doesn't cover the white part of the note. I have problem with Petrucci/Sonata since their :5 has to thin contours which are obscured when placed on the line. The most balanced half note is Maestro, and perhaps also SCORE/Vienna – in my opinion.
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OCTO
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by OCTO »

My attempt with the default fonts.
scrsht 2019-10-15 at 13.34.22.jpg
scrsht 2019-10-15 at 13.34.22.jpg (260.34 KiB) Viewed 7272 times
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Schonbergian
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by Schonbergian »

John, I adore your engraving but just wish you'd use a roman font other than TNR. It stands out from the well-balanced whole like a sore thumb.

I agree on Russian/French editions being readable with smaller noteheads; that being said, they are still much larger and fuller than most computer music scores, and still accomplish the effect I was talking about. Larger noteheads also have the effect of making the distinction between smaller noteheads (grace notes, Chopin's dual-layer effects) and full-size notes much more prominent at a glance.
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John Ruggero
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by John Ruggero »

OCTO, that is beautiful and warmer than mine. Your conclusions regarding note head shape are exactly what struck me about the font. Perhaps odod will be inspired to recreate it. Odod, some of the spacing is not good in the default file I posted, so please feel free to change it in your versions. Also, I should have removed the cautionary key and time signatures at the end of the line.

An explanation regarding the slurs: I am preserving their position in the original sources because there is the possibility that it is meaningful. Note that the original slurs in ms. 3 and 5 are over the beams. This might mean that the slur is intended for both hands, as opposed to the slurs in ms. 4. I've seen this elsewhere in the sonatas. I am still undecided whether I should supply editorial slurs in such cases. The number of slurs that seem to be are "missing" is unusual, and I haven't come to any conclusions about it since I have only started editing the piece. Beethoven may have run out of steam by the end of writing such a piece.

Thank you for your compliment, Schonbergian, and also for your advice. I assume you mean the tempo marking. (The rest is in Wess's beautiful italic font.) I am afraid that my lack of sophistication is showing, but here are my reasons:

I use TNR for the footnotes, because I have not been able to find another font that is as readable in a small point size. So maybe I fear too many different fonts on the same page. since I use New Century Schoolbook for things like Scherzo, Trio etc. As well, I actually like a tempo marking that stands out and have no aversion to TNR. What font would you suggest as a replacement(s)? I definitely need help.
Last edited by John Ruggero on 15 Oct 2019, 21:40, edited 1 time in total.
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David Ward
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by David Ward »

Shouldn't that be mezza voce with a feminine ending ‘half voice’ and an example of Beethoven's use of a vocal technique term in instrumental music. To a singer it would suggest singing without full vocal tone usually pianissimo, perhaps achievable here on the piano via the una corda.
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John Ruggero
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Re: "Warmth" and Note Size

Post by John Ruggero »

Thanks for the catch, David. I may be as bad a proofreader as Beethoven. (The comparison ends there.) Of course it should be mezza voce. The first edition abbreviates it "mez. voce". Almost all the editions including Schenker's spell it out "mezza voce." I have no idea why Craxton-Tovey has mezzo voce, or why I misspelled it. Maybe an unconscious reference to sotto voce? Beethoven does sometimes use "alternate" Italian spelling like ligato for legato, but that may be archaic. I think I may keep ligato etc.
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