Dorico Pro 2 released

Recommendations concerning notation and publishing software in a non-partisan environment.
Schonbergian
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by Schonbergian » 12 Jun 2018, 15:24

I still feel like the "Sibelius"-style slurs and ties curve too much near the ends. LP has the same issue by default, albeit a bit less pronounced.

benwiggy
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by benwiggy » 12 Jun 2018, 21:50

OCTO wrote:
12 Jun 2018, 11:12
Some concerns about the ligature shapes (ties and slurs).
They don't look well imo, as it is case with the Sibelius default.
...some ties look like slurs, and v-v.
Well-spotted, OCTO. Some of that may be due to problems in the 'translation' of XML from Finale to Dorico, which is not perfect. If I re-enter the notes by hand, those ties look more consistent. (A couple of other strange things were fixed when re-entered.)

The defaults may also need adjusting (as with Finale). There is a large set of settings for adjusting the slur and tie shapes. I will need to play around.

However, from my assessment, I see no reason why I should not do all my work in Dorico from now on. Given the the time I saved on all the manual adjustments which Finale would have required, I don't feel so bad about doing a couple here and there in Dorico.

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OCTO
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by OCTO » 13 Jun 2018, 16:23

benwiggy wrote:
12 Jun 2018, 21:50
However, from my assessment, I see no reason why I should not do all my work in Dorico from now on. Given the the time I saved on all the manual adjustments which Finale would have required, I don't feel so bad about doing a couple here and there in Dorico.
For what you do, it looks that it would suit you well. Why not, if you work alone in your edition.
Also, your 'example' score in Dorico looks more like "printed" - in a positive meaning.

The thing I hear often about Dorico is that it "looks" pleasant. I wonder why? My guessing is that it looks more "fat" and more "round" than both Sibelius and Finale. I has something appealing about the object-spacing (that is drastically different in Sibelius, however better in Finale), and I think that is a very important aspect.

Unfortunately, I am unable to work in Dorico, perhaps because of the one heavy reason: there are no so many engravers versed in advanced notation in Dorico, yet price-competitive. Usually I do only fine tuning of my scores, and other people do engraving. Until the critical mass is reached, I think Dorico will be very advanced, and prices would drop. I would love to do my scores alone, but as being once injured in Finale (because of a deadline, and about almost a half million clicks in three weeks frame) I can't work more than hour two.
Freelance Composer. Self-Publisher.
Finale 25 • Sibelius 8 • MuseScore 2 • Logic Pro X • Ableton Live 9 • Digital Performer 9 /// OS X El Capitan, (side system: Debian 9, Windows 7)

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OCTO
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by OCTO » 13 Jun 2018, 16:31

Schonbergian wrote:
12 Jun 2018, 15:24
I still feel like the "Sibelius"-style slurs and ties curve too much near the ends. LP has the same issue by default, albeit a bit less pronounced.
Yes, that is what I distaste about Sibelius. That one and the g clef. My first two things I change in Sibelius.
Schonbergian wrote:
12 Jun 2018, 15:24
LP has the same issue by default, albeit a bit less pronounced.
LP? Logic Pro?? Do you make any engraving in it? I've never tried, just for display of pitches, but I would never dare to do it for the final publications.
Freelance Composer. Self-Publisher.
Finale 25 • Sibelius 8 • MuseScore 2 • Logic Pro X • Ableton Live 9 • Digital Performer 9 /// OS X El Capitan, (side system: Debian 9, Windows 7)

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liuscorne
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by liuscorne » 13 Jun 2018, 20:36

More likely, LP = LilyPond?

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OCTO
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by OCTO » 13 Jun 2018, 22:20

Oh, boy... My brain is full of pancakes.
LilyPond!!
Freelance Composer. Self-Publisher.
Finale 25 • Sibelius 8 • MuseScore 2 • Logic Pro X • Ableton Live 9 • Digital Performer 9 /// OS X El Capitan, (side system: Debian 9, Windows 7)

Schonbergian
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by Schonbergian » 16 Jun 2018, 03:59

OCTO wrote:
13 Jun 2018, 16:23
For what you do, it looks that it would suit you well. Why not, if you work alone in your edition.
Also, your 'example' score in Dorico looks more like "printed" - in a positive meaning.

The thing I hear often about Dorico is that it "looks" pleasant. I wonder why? My guessing is that it looks more "fat" and more "round" than both Sibelius and Finale. I has something appealing about the object-spacing (that is drastically different in Sibelius, however better in Finale), and I think that is a very important aspect.

Unfortunately, I am unable to work in Dorico, perhaps because of the one heavy reason: there are no so many engravers versed in advanced notation in Dorico, yet price-competitive. Usually I do only fine tuning of my scores, and other people do engraving. Until the critical mass is reached, I think Dorico will be very advanced, and prices would drop. I would love to do my scores alone, but as being once injured in Finale (because of a deadline, and about almost a half million clicks in three weeks frame) I can't work more than hour two.
I think it's because it looks like music.

I've seen "modern-looking" engraving from the 70s onward that is perfectly clear and stark, just like a computer would do it. (PWM edition of Chopin, for instance, or some of the later Breitkopf engravings) Dorico's output looks just like that - obviously clear and sharp and computerized, but it doesn't stand out as being sloppy because it's all been harmonized to look even and equal.

Default Finale and pretty much anything out of Sibelius look like something created by someone who's never seen a proper page of music or even understood the slightest thing about typography and design. There are just so many glaring issues with what they produce. It's the equivalent of seeing everything text-based typed in a poorly kerned and segmented version of TNR, with older engravings as Garamond and Dorico/the "modern" hand-engravings as Bodoni, if that makes any sense.

benwiggy
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by benwiggy » 10 Jul 2018, 12:35

If I may, I've written a blog for Dorico about the conceptual differences between Finale and Dorico, and it also includes my first 'finished' piece.

https://blog.dorico.com/2018/07/from-fi ... ers-story/

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tisimst
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by tisimst » 10 Jul 2018, 13:18

Nice work, benwiggy!
Music Typeface Designer & Engraver - LilyPond | Sibelius | Finale | MuseScore | Dorico | SMuFL | Inkscape | FontForge
http://www.musictypefoundry.com

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OCTO
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Re: Dorico Pro 2 released

Post by OCTO » 11 Jul 2018, 10:52

Wonderful – We need stories like that!
Freelance Composer. Self-Publisher.
Finale 25 • Sibelius 8 • MuseScore 2 • Logic Pro X • Ableton Live 9 • Digital Performer 9 /// OS X El Capitan, (side system: Debian 9, Windows 7)

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