Finale fonts available for download

Music notation symbols, fonts, font sources and font creation, SmuFL.
benwiggy
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Finale fonts available for download

Post by benwiggy »

MM have provided installers for their new fonts, which are available to download here:

https://makemusic.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/ ... nformation

Bear in mind that the installer will also install all the legacy Finale fonts, of which there are a LOT. These have not been updated, and so should be identical to the ones you already have. (Although there were some OTF versions released a while ago of Engraver fonts, and some others.)

But if you don't have Finale, you may not want these.

It will also install JSON files for the Text fonts, even though these Text fonts are just text fonts, and not "music text" fonts like Bravura Text. If you keep the JSON files, then things like Finale Jazz Text will show up as a Music font in Dorico’s Music Font dialog. But it’s not a music font.

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JoshNichols
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by JoshNichols »

This is great.

Now the fun will begin deciding what default output is Finale or Dorico. This should be a fun test.
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benwiggy
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by benwiggy »

Yes, I think there's an interesting test to be made here. (Though of course it could have previously been done in Sebastian or November2.)

Finale's defaults are pretty risible, I think it's universally agreed. Dorico's defaults are much more satisfactory, even if not optimal.

There are still things that will give it away.

But the real question is 'what do we want to test?' We know what Finale can achieve if you put the work in, and we know what it does if you don't. Similarly, we know what Dorico does by default, and we know what you can do beyond that.

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Fred G. Unn
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by Fred G. Unn »

benwiggy wrote:
19 Jul 2021, 11:30
Yes, I think there's an interesting test to be made here.
...
But the real question is 'what do we want to test?'
I'm up to play if you have a piece you'd like to use as a test.

benwiggy
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by benwiggy »

Again, it depends what we want to test. Here's a PDF I did in Finale a while ago, so "Maestro", not SMuFL Maestro; and the imported XML in Dorico, with Finale Maestro font. Neither are the default app's options, and I've done a bit of work on both of them.

I've labelled them with the apps, because it's obvious. (I did the Finale file on B5 for some reason.)

Lots of problems in the organ part: The slur doesn't accommodate the accidental in 23; there's clashing in bar 38; there's not enough space for the hairpins; the double flat in 82 doesn't 'nest' well under the single flat. Yes, I could have aligned the p < f dynamics on page 5 in Finale, but I didn't get round to it. Most of my time was spent manually adjusting the noteheads in bottom of p6 / top of 7.

What this really reveals is my lack of patience before I go "that'll do"! :oops: It shows what I didn't do in Finale, and what I didn't have to do in Dorico. (It was the comparison of this very piece that made me switch.)

Also included is a 'straight' XML import to Finale 27, to get the SMuFL Finale Maestro. As you can see, there's loads of clashing that needs to be manually restored. This is with factory defaults.
Attachments
F27 Expectans.pdf
(720.01 KiB) Downloaded 43 times
Dorico Expectans.pdf
(203.6 KiB) Downloaded 56 times
Finale Expectans.pdf
(539.25 KiB) Downloaded 42 times

benwiggy
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by benwiggy »

One difference between the programs is that Finale draws the piano brace from curves, whereas Dorico uses font glyphs (of varying sizes for different lengths). In Finale, you can set the parameters of the brace shape; in Dorico, you can replace the glyphs with those from another font, or from a vector graphic.

Conversely, the system bracket 'wings' in Dorico are also defined in the font, and can be replaced by those from another font, or from an imported graphic. Finale doesn't have a way to adjust the wings.

benwiggy
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by benwiggy »

I did read somewhere that the Maestro glyphs in the new font have been revised and improved where necessary. I'm sure it's nothing that will affect metrics, but hopefully just smoothing out contours and intersections.

I still hate the Breves, which are the worst of any font!

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John Ruggero
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by John Ruggero »

That was a very helpful exercise, Ben.

In your example, the Dorico piano braces assume much less attractive shapes as the distance between the staves changes (perhaps for the reason you mentioned). Is there is a way to correct that? If not, it would rule out the program for me. Finale piano braces have a similar issue, but only when the distance between the staves is much smaller than this, and it can be handled to some extent by settings changes.

I see a lot of things that I would need to change by hand in all the examples, such as the ones you mentioned in the Finale file. Both programs don't position or shape short slurs very well on their own so they get absorbed into the staff lines. For example, m. 22 of the bass part. Dynamic and other signs are not well positioned at times. For example, in m. 91 of the Dorico file the accents are too far from the notes.

Some of the dynamic signs are not aligned between the staves when they should be: Dorico ex. m. 43 in the organ part, and they are often too far away from the notes as in m. 45 soprano. In the Finale example, they are often a little too close to the notes and too far to the left. Dorico does a pretty good job of centering the dynamics over the first note but is strangely inconsistent: compare m. 47 with ms. 48-49.

So I concluded that if I used Dorico, I would need to make a lot if hand changes just as I do in Finale, but maybe a little less.

It would be very interesting to pit Dorico against Finale using Perfect Layout.
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benwiggy
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by benwiggy »

Thank, John.

The piano brace in Dorico will be the one(s) that are in the Finale Maestro font. As said, you could change them for those in another font, or for a specially-designed graphic, using the Music Symbols Editor. There are three or four different sizes of bracket that are used for different distances.

Because the music was imported to Dorico as an XML from Finale, it's possible that not everything may be as Dorico would have entered it, and better results might occur if I were to re-enter the dynamics in Dorico, as the manner in which you create dynamics can affect how they appear.

It's possible that my choice of Engraving Options (or indeed, the factory defaults) for slurs may not be optimal: there were some additional options for slurs in v3.5, I think, and I can't remember if I used my current defaults for this file, or if it still uses older settings. One of the great things I like about Dorico is that the Engraving Options are numerous, well explained with graphical examples, and instantly have a global effect over the document.

If we really wanted to go to town, we could compete to submit a page of music produced from scratch in Dorico, Finale, Sibelius and MuseScore, with the time taken (though some people are very fast in their chosen app), and how much was manually done.

Interestingly, someone on MakeMusic's Help forum was talking about Perfect Layout vs. Dorico, and I was thinking about how to create a fair test of that.

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John Ruggero
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Re: Finale fonts available for download

Post by John Ruggero »

Piano braces in the Maestro font??? Is that new? Anyway, I am going to download Dorico for iPad to see how Dorico piano braces actually work in practice. A comparison of the different engraving apps would have to be elaborate to be meaningful.
Mac mini (OS 10.8.5) with dual monitors, Kurzweil Mark 5 with M-Audio Midisport 2 x 2,
Finale 2014d with GPO 4, JW Plug-ins, SmartScore X Pro, Adobe InDesign CS4,
Inkscape .48.5 and .91, FontForge 20150526
http://www.cantilenapress.com

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