articulation direction question.

[MichelRE]

in this short passage, starting at the "rit", should the stem-down notes have their staccato dots above the noteheads? or below the stems (like the following tenuto marks)?

[MalteM]

I’m not an expert on articulation but to me the stem directions look weird, at least without rests in the first voice. (I don’t play the violin but the cello.) With a rest in the first voice you’d probably put the staccato below, wouldn’t you?

Also, are the eighths e-f-g and d-e♭-f supposed to be triplets? Seems so if you look at the second voice but it’s not immediately obvious in free meter.

Sorry for being a bit off-topic …

[MichelRE]

well, I COULD return the rests to those beats. I had specifically removed them, keeping the one rest before the up-stemmed triple (yes, they're triplets) as a sort of marker to indicate how much time there was before the D string notes.

[JJP]

Technically, it looks like the staccatos above the notes are correct. The top voice does not exist on that beat. I agree that having no rest on that beat, but having the later rests over dotted halves, does make the line clear. (This is solo violin, correct?)

OFF TOPIC: Without knowing the tempo, and not being a violinist myself, how are you imagining the dotted halves be interpreted? Would they be sustained on the G string under the following notes on the other string, or simply allowed to resonate without being bowed?

[Magnus Johansson]

well, I COULD return the rests to those beats. I had specifically removed them, keeping the one rest before the up-stemmed triple (yes, they're triplets) as a sort of marker to indicate how much time there was before the D string notes.

Yes, I think you should restore the rests and let the triplets have a 3, and then like Malte suggested, write the triplet staccato dots at stem ends.

[MichelRE]

OFF TOPIC: Without knowing the tempo, and not being a violinist myself, how are you imagining the dotted halves be interpreted? Would they be sustained on the G string under the following notes on the other string, or simply allowed to resonate without being bowed?

down-stem notes all on G string, held through rising triplet on D string.

[LSL2026]

in this short passage, starting at the "rit", should the stem-down notes have their staccato dots above the noteheads? or below the stems (like the following tenuto marks)?

I agree that it’s unclear as to if these other groups of 3 are triplets or not.

This is what’s up:

The staccato notes appear to have been entered in voice 1, and the stems flipped.

The tenuto notes appear to have been entered in voice 2, and the rest above hidden.

I get why you might want that line to visually lead to the low dotted half note.

So, IMO they should both be in voice 2, with rests above since the half notes have to be in voice 2.

This will not only make the articulations on the outside for both, and make it consistent, but also the rests will help the player understand that these are 8th notes in the 2nd instance, as there will be a dotted 8th rest, or 1/4 and 8th above.

That doesn’t help with the stems up 8th note “trios” though.

I would put a note in the score that “all triplets are marked; any other groups of 3 notes beamed together are standard 8th notes” or something like that.

Either that, or break up the 8th note groups into 1 flagged and 2 beamed.

Or some dashed barlines wouldn’t be amiss here - at least in the current layout. The 1/4 notes with the breath mark look like they could overlap into the next figure (but see, the rest above would solve that).

Some horizontal bracket lines showing the length of the dotted half notes wouldn’t go amiss either.

So there are some addition helpers that could be used to clarify.

But the rests above the 2nd voice notes really solve the issue, and put the staccato where they’re supposed to go.

And realistically, the lower voice needs it’s rests properly too - it’s like you’re trying to hide the rests as unnecessary, but because it’s unmetered and you’ve got odd numbered groups, the rests become very helpful again not only to distinguish the parts, but to show durations as well.

[MichelRE]

I restored the triplets indications, though they are really not important in the larger context of the music. There are so many triplets preceding the above quoted passage, that it is obvious that these are also triplets.

as for the staccato notes, those are already in voice 2.
although since this is an a piacere cadenza passage, I'm not particularly bothered if it is played as 3 eighth notes, or as a triplet. the "feel" will be there no matter which way it is played.

[LSL2026]

as for the staccato notes, those are already in voice 2.

It may just be that the tenuto go outside the staff, period, so as not to get confused with staff lines.

So in voice 2, they HAVE to go below here.

But staccato can go in the space. So even though the notes are in voice 2, it may simply be that since the rest was hidden, they revert to their “normal” position opposite the stem.

It’d be interesting to put the rest back in there and see what they do.

Certainly if there were notes in voice 1, the staccato would go on the stem side.

But they’re certainly easy to read where they are, and as you say, since it’s a cadenza, if the rhythm is not that important (i.e. flexible) then I’d personally rather see those staccato dots right where they are!

[Mr_Incognito]

Not really about articulation - rather an ornament - but this ornament is in Finale's Articulations section, so I guess the thread is right...

I was going through some old sketches, and noticed that Finale by default placed pralltriller under the notehead of a note that has stem up - so it is below staff. Can that be correct?