Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

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orchestracomposer
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Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by orchestracomposer » 25 Nov 2019, 17:45

Hello!

As a composer and copyist, I am currently reading books on music engraving, music copying and music preparation, to get different views on the topic and widen my perspectives on the subject matter. I have already assembled a reading-list composed of the following authors: William Gamble, Karl Hader, Antony Donato, Ted Ross, Clinton Roemer, Ken J. Williams, Kurt Stone, Elaine Gould (for the time being, I have no intention to read Gardner Read).

In my research, I came across the following books, but I have not found much about them, and I wonder if the information they contain overlap too much with the other books or if there is any unique perspective or information.
Have you read the following titles?

- Alan Boustead: Writing Down Music: A Practical Guide to Preparing Music Manuscript (I wonder if this is really a book on music copying, or rather a basic guide about hand-writing music. I am especially curious about the chapter "TimeSaving and TimeWasting".)

- Mona Mender: Music Manuscript Preparation: A Concise Guide (I have not much info on this book.)

- Herbert Chlapik: Die Praxis des Notengraphikers: Wie entstehen unsere Noten? (Is it sort of a concise Ted Ross/Elaine Gould, or are there unique information not found in the others?)

If you know any of these books, I would be glad to hear what you think about it :)
Otherwise, if I find no further information, maybe I will (blindly) decide to read them or not!

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John Ruggero
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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by John Ruggero » 28 Nov 2019, 17:36

So far, no one seems to know these latter three. Perhaps you should carry out your proposal to read them and report back. I, for one, would be interested to know if there is anything of interest in them.

While I have found several of the books you mentioned, like Gould and Ross, to be educational, practical experience and access to an extensive library of printed music has been even more helpful.
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orchestracomposer
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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by orchestracomposer » 28 Nov 2019, 20:06

Thank you for your answer, John.

I do agree with you that nothing can replace the practice of copying/preparing music and reading a lot of printed scores (which I have done for a number of years).

However, I have found that reading Ted Ross and Elaine Gould have "opened my eyes" to a number of details I had never given a thought before (even though I do not agree with all they say). Now I notice many more details in scores and I am in the process of fine-tuning my eye. This will also help me to pass on this information to my students in a concise manner.

So, I have this personal project to read the other books (Henri Robert, William Gamble, Karl Hader, Antony Donato, Clinton Roemer, Ken J. Williams, Kurt Stone) and review extensively what they say and in what cases they are the most useful. It will be in French, but I can write a short summary about each book here if it can be of interest to some.

For the books of Mona Mender, Alan Boustead and Herbert Chlapik, if I find no more information I think I will wait till I have finished reading the aforementioned books to decide wether to read them or not.

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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by MalteM » 28 Nov 2019, 20:37

I read Chlapik a while ago but none of the others so I cannot compare ;) (only parts of Gould and some pages of Read)

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John Ruggero
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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by John Ruggero » 28 Nov 2019, 23:40

You are most welcome. orchestracomposer. it is amazing how much detail is overlooked by even the most experienced professionals. There is always something new to learn.

I think that your impressions of these various books would be very interesting to Notat.io readers.
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Fred G. Unn
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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by Fred G. Unn » 29 Nov 2019, 03:47

orchestracomposer wrote:
28 Nov 2019, 20:06
For the books of Mona Mender, Alan Boustead and Herbert Chlapik, if I find no more information I think I will wait till I have finished reading the aforementioned books to decide wether to read them or not.
I sorta collect music engraving books so I own and have read many of the books you have listed. I don't have the Mona Mender book, but I have the Boustead and Chlapik. Unfortunately I don't speak German (although Google Translate with the iOS is very helpful) so I can't really discuss the usefulness of the Chlapik. I mostly bought it because I found a used copy for really cheap and was curious about the engraving depicted within. It's relatively short at 104 pages so I'd be happy to scan a few pages if there is a subject you are interested in.

Like Roemer, Williams, etc., the Boustead is designed for the hand copyist. I actually quite like it. It's an easy read, and it is written informally. It basically reads more like him telling the reader, often in first person, how he does his work rather than a reference book. As such, it's a more interesting read, but less useful as a reference IMO. Again, if there's a subject you are particularly interested in, I'd be happy to scan a few pages.

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Fred G. Unn
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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by Fred G. Unn » 29 Nov 2019, 04:12

orchestracomposer wrote:
25 Nov 2019, 17:45
I have already assembled a reading-list composed of the following authors: William Gamble, Karl Hader, Antony Donato, Ted Ross, Clinton Roemer, Ken J. Williams, Kurt Stone, Elaine Gould (for the time being, I have no intention to read Gardner Read).
My own perspective on these:

Gamble: I have the 1979 reprint of the 1923 version. Very interesting reference on plate engraving. Not so useful in terms of modern publication or engraving rules.

Hader: I don't have it and don't speak German.

Donato: I have the 1963 version. Useful as a hand copying reference. Fairly basic, doesn't get in to engraving minutia, but some of the spacing and layout info is quite useful.

Ross: Essential, a must own.

Roemer: Great book on hand copying, especially in regard to jazz and commercial music. Classic.

Ken Williams: I'm very biased here, but I learned a lot from his book as a young copyist. I used to get my supplies from Associated Music on 52nd St where Judy Haring sold this book. I also was John Lewis's copyist the last few years of his life, and as he revised a lot of his earlier works I got to study Ken's work. (Ken was Mr. Lewis's copyist for years and Mr. Lewis wrote the forward to Ken's book.) This is essential for me, but I can't really offer an unbiased opinion.

Stone: Great reference. Prior to the publication of Gould, my go-to references were Ross, Stone, and Read.

Gould: Really the current standard. I don't always agree with everything she states, especially some stylistic choices, but the most comprehensive current reference. A must own.

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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by orchestracomposer » 29 Nov 2019, 08:28

John Ruggero wrote:
28 Nov 2019, 23:40
I think that your impressions of these various books would be very interesting to Notat.io readers.
Ok! I have found a copy of most of them and will post my impressions in the next few months, after reading.

And thank you for your impressions on all the books, Fred G. Unn!
Fred G. Unn wrote:
29 Nov 2019, 03:47
I don't speak German (although Google Translate with the iOS is very helpful) so I can't really discuss the usefulness of the Chlapik.
Neither do I, in fact! ;) However, in my family, some people are native German speakers, so with translate and a little help from their part, I think that I can roughly understand what is said.
Fred G. Unn wrote:
29 Nov 2019, 03:47
Like Roemer, Williams, etc., the Boustead is designed for the hand copyist. I actually quite like it. It's an easy read, and it is written informally. It basically reads more like him telling the reader, often in first person, how he does his work rather than a reference book. As such, it's a more interesting read, but less useful as a reference IMO. Again, if there's a subject you are particularly interested in, I'd be happy to scan a few pages.
Interesting! Thank you for this information. I am especially curious about the chapter "TimeSaving and TimeWasting". I would also be interested to see a few pages from "Some First Attempts", if you can.
Fred G. Unn wrote:
29 Nov 2019, 04:12
Hader: I don't have it and don't speak German.
I found a copy of this very short book (about 70 pages). It will not be the easiest to read for me, but the images are beautiful, and different from those found in the William Gamble or Henri Robert books. I think it will also give a German perspective to the topic of plate engraving, alongside the English (Gamble) and French (Robert) perspectives.
Fred G. Unn wrote:
29 Nov 2019, 04:12
Ken Williams: I'm very biased here, but I learned a lot from his book as a young copyist. I used to get my supplies from Associated Music on 52nd St where Judy Haring sold this book. I also was John Lewis's copyist the last few years of his life, and as he revised a lot of his earlier works I got to study Ken's work. (Ken was Mr. Lewis's copyist for years and Mr. Lewis wrote the forward to Ken's book.) This is essential for me, but I can't really offer an unbiased opinion.
Nice story! After what you said, I am looking forward to reading this book. For now, I have just flipped through the pages, but I like what I have seen so far. It seems to be a no-nonsense book with a lot of useful information.

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Fred G. Unn
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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by Fred G. Unn » 29 Nov 2019, 15:13

orchestracomposer wrote:
29 Nov 2019, 08:28
Interesting! Thank you for this information. I am especially curious about the chapter "TimeSaving and TimeWasting".
Here are scans of the last two chapters of the book:

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orchestracomposer
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Re: Has anyone read the following books? (Boustead, Mender, Chlapik)

Post by orchestracomposer » 29 Nov 2019, 16:41

Wow! Thank you very much, Fred!

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