O/T bariolage question

Have your scores reviewed by other users. Comment on old and new published scores and on publishers.
User avatar
OCTO
Posts: 1742
Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 06:52
Location: Sweden

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by OCTO »

Or here, Ysaye, Sonata No 3:
Attachments
2022-02-06 (3).jpg
2022-02-06 (3).jpg (84.96 KiB) Viewed 5942 times
Freelance Composer. Self-Publisher.
Finale 27.3 • Sibelius 2023.5• MuseScore 4+ • Logic Pro X+ • Ableton Live 11+ • Digital Performer 10+ /// MacOS Monterey (secondary in use systems: Fedora 35, Windows 10)
MichelRE
Posts: 251
Joined: 07 Aug 2021, 17:11

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by MichelRE »

going by your comment, if I break the beams for the open strings, the notation becomes VERY messy and difficult to follow.

what I got from a video on bariolage by a violin teacher, was that in the bariolage passage the lower string gets down-stem, the upper gets up-stem.

I don't know about it being playable on the piano. I have absolutely no difficulty playing the passage as I've notated it on the piano. I can even muddle my way through it on my viola.
MichelRE
Posts: 251
Joined: 07 Aug 2021, 17:11

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by MichelRE »

in the Ysaye example, I'm presuming the "melody" is played on the G string (until the B natural, where it switches to the A string)?
User avatar
OCTO
Posts: 1742
Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 06:52
Location: Sweden

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by OCTO »

MichelRE wrote: 06 Feb 2022, 20:39 in the Ysaye example, I'm presuming the "melody" is played on the G string (until the B natural, where it switches to the A string)?
Exactly so.
MichelRE wrote: 06 Feb 2022, 20:37 going by your comment, if I break the beams for the open strings, the notation becomes VERY messy and difficult to follow.
That's why I proposed to attach a musx file of these measures in order to manipulate with it easily. Possible?
MichelRE wrote: 06 Feb 2022, 20:37 what I got from a video on bariolage by a violin teacher, was that in the bariolage passage the lower string gets down-stem, the upper gets up-stem.
That can also be true IF the bottom string has a particular significance like in this example of Ysaÿe (Solo Sonata No.2 A minor, Movement 1):
2022-02-07.jpg
2022-02-07.jpg (134.83 KiB) Viewed 5927 times
Freelance Composer. Self-Publisher.
Finale 27.3 • Sibelius 2023.5• MuseScore 4+ • Logic Pro X+ • Ableton Live 11+ • Digital Performer 10+ /// MacOS Monterey (secondary in use systems: Fedora 35, Windows 10)
MichelRE
Posts: 251
Joined: 07 Aug 2021, 17:11

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by MichelRE »

coming back to this topic:

almost every (Actually, every!) example I've come across of bariolage has been 8ths or 16th notes. mine is in triplets.

So should all the notes that are open string have their stems in the same direction (ie: opposite to fingered strings?)
it seems to me this will definitely become a very messy section of the viola part with all those single 8th notes up and down stemmed.
MichelRE
Posts: 251
Joined: 07 Aug 2021, 17:11

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by MichelRE »

Is this a better way to notate my bariolage?
Attachments
bariolage.jpg
bariolage.jpg (614.9 KiB) Viewed 5640 times
User avatar
John Ruggero
Posts: 2453
Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 14:25
Location: Raleigh, NC USA

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by John Ruggero »

It looks very good to me, Michel.
M1 Mac mini (OS 12.4), Dorico, Finale 25.5, GPO 4, Affinity Publisher 2, SmartScore 64 Pro, JW Plug-ins, TG Tools, Keyboard maestro

http://www.cantilenapress.com
Felipe Copaja
Posts: 20
Joined: 06 Mar 2017, 19:18

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by Felipe Copaja »

Interesting...

It is playable, as long as you stay in the D string, but if you wish the A string to be used there will be some jumps that may obscure the bariolage effect. I put a bracket to show where. But, you could also reverse this, playing the stopped note first, then the open and go to A string.
I reproduced your sample, wrote it in 12/8 for simplicity and added the probable fingering a violist would use. Note the bowings, that could produce some unwanted accents, depending on how fast this is to be played.
At the end of this passage, C string is used, not D one.

Cheers,
Felipe Copaja
Attachments
Captura de Pantalla 2023-03-02 a la(s) 12.24.50.png
Captura de Pantalla 2023-03-02 a la(s) 12.24.50.png (92 KiB) Viewed 4348 times
MichelRE
Posts: 251
Joined: 07 Aug 2021, 17:11

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by MichelRE »

Felipe, I presume the brackets underneath the staff at measures 1 and 3 indicate that the same string is intended?

Also, the very last beat of the last measure, I see a little"0" over a C... but that can't be an open string.Unless you meant that as the octave harmonic?
Felipe Copaja
Posts: 20
Joined: 06 Mar 2017, 19:18

Re: O/T bariolage question

Post by Felipe Copaja »

Those brackets just show that if the second note is to be played in A string, there would be a string jump from the G string. As written, the second note is played in the D string.
And yes, at the end is the octave harmonic, should be a little circle.

P.S. only after sending the post I saw it was from last year... sorry, you probably are done with this long time ago.
Post Reply