- fables-of-faubus-manuscript.jpg (242.28 KiB) Viewed 3806 times
Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
More calligraphic: Lee Morgan
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
And finally Jaki Byard
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
The very last from my manuscript collection and off-topic regarding chord symbols:
Some lyricists prefered typewriters over pens and pencils:
Some lyricists prefered typewriters over pens and pencils:
- David Ward
- Posts: 529
- Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 19:50
- Location: Aberdeenshire, Scotland
- Contact:
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
Can somebody please enlighten me on the significance and meaning of the word ‘fake’ here (and in some of the other responses).John Ruggero wrote: ↑20 Feb 2022, 16:01 … … … …I give an example from one of my father's personal fake cards below.
This is a world about which I know less than perhaps I should (and less than I once knew in the late 1960s early 70s when I did some work on its fringes). I'm finding this discussion fascinating.
- Fred G. Unn
- Posts: 439
- Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 13:24
- Location: NYCish
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
Typically a D11 would have a G appearing a minor ninth (or displaced by one or more octaves) above a F#, hence the 11th. Otherwise it would be C/D, Am7/D, D7sus, etc. It's not super common, but examples are found easily enough.
The pyramid in Charlie Barnet's Skyliner is a fairly well-known example (at least among arrangers) that arpeggiates straight up an Ab13 with a natural 11th (as opposed to #11)
![Image](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51893671873_380d096a7a_z.jpg)
Duke Ellington uses a very distinctive Db11 chord in the opening melody statement of Blue Serge with a Gb a minor 9th above the F.
![Image](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51894238365_201b9b783f_z.jpg)
Duke actually uses 11th chords quite a lot. Here's a my reduction of the intro to Concerto for Cootie, which has two 11th chords with the 11th appearing above the 3rd.
![Image](https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51893601876_3b33b76c5e_b.jpg)
Some of Duke's longer works such as A Tone Parallel to Harlem have a lot of 11th chords in them as well. Perhaps that's not what Monk meant by that nomenclature in your example, but that's certainly how an 11th chord would be commonly interpreted today.
- Fred G. Unn
- Posts: 439
- Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 13:24
- Location: NYCish
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
A "fake" book typically just contains lead sheets or sometimes only chord changes, but not fully orchestrated arrangements. It's enough for a musician to "fake" a version of the tune on a gig. The quality level of these of course varies wildly. The Shur "New Real Book" series is quite accurate and sometimes even includes complete arrangements. Others are fairly terrible and have wrong notes, wrong chords, wrong keys, etc. At student or amateur level jam sessions for example, people still play John Coltrane's Equinox, a Db minor blues, in C minor because it is in the wrong key in the original Real Book. Experienced musicians can collectively improvise an entire arrangement from a lead sheet, "fake" card, etc.David Ward wrote: ↑20 Feb 2022, 21:21 Can somebody please enlighten me on the significance and meaning of the word ‘fake’ here (and in some of the other responses).
- John Ruggero
- Posts: 2476
- Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 14:25
- Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
Hi bobhead. I know what rhythm slashes are and see them in the Monk part. My comment was in response to Fred comment about the D 11.bophead wrote: ↑20 Feb 2022, 18:18 @ John Ruggero: The slashes in Monk's lead sheet don't show "something over something", (bass note or polychord) but rhythm shorthand: one slash stands for one quarter beat – same thing as in Fred G. Unn’s Lee Morgan example above. In the first bar of "Monk's Mood" the Fm7 (notated with a "minus") lasts 2 beats, then Bb7/b5 for one beat and C [C6] on the 4 etc. Its those slashes written below the chord names. There are (rhythm) slashes below the 11th chords as well in the 1a volta repeat.
What I meant was that I DON''T see any slash notation in the Monk of the type that shows bass notes under a chord like Am7/D and was under the impression that that kind of notation was not used yet when Monk wrote the part so that would explain why he used a D 11 instead of a Am7/D.
M1 Mac mini (OS 12.4), Dorico, Finale 25.5, GPO 4, Affinity Publisher 2, SmartScore 64 Pro, JW Plug-ins, TG Tools, Keyboard maestro
http://www.cantilenapress.com
http://www.cantilenapress.com
- John Ruggero
- Posts: 2476
- Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 14:25
- Location: Raleigh, NC USA
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
Regarding fake books. The original fake books were actually illegal since they contained copyrighted material. I remember a relative of mine describing how he got his fake books by going to a "certain" store in NYC, giving a password or something, and handing over a considerable amount of money. They were named "Fake Book no. 5" etc. So one built up a collection of these.
M1 Mac mini (OS 12.4), Dorico, Finale 25.5, GPO 4, Affinity Publisher 2, SmartScore 64 Pro, JW Plug-ins, TG Tools, Keyboard maestro
http://www.cantilenapress.com
http://www.cantilenapress.com
- Fred G. Unn
- Posts: 439
- Joined: 05 Oct 2015, 13:24
- Location: NYCish
Re: Positioning Chord Symbols and Rehearsal Marks for Jazz
My first Real Book was actually an illegal copy purchased "under the counter" from Marsh Woodwinds (now closed) in Raleigh!John Ruggero wrote: ↑20 Feb 2022, 23:23 The original fake books were actually illegal since they contained copyrighted material.